2019-08-10 秋名山老司机 45060
原创翻译:龙腾网 http://www.ltaaa.com 翻译:lxlewis 转载请注明出处

Futurist: What would Mongolia's fate during the 20th and 21st centuries have been had it remained part of China? Would it have become Sinified as a result of large-scale movement of Han Chinese settlers into Xinjiang? Would there have been any other significant effects on Mongolia?

原创翻译:龙腾网 http://www.ltaaa.com 翻译:lxlewis 转载请注明出处

评论1: Swamp Booger: Mongolian beef would be called Beijing beef.


Futurist: LOL! :D Even if Mongolia would have been part of China, it would have still been separated from Beijing by a relatively long distance.


Swamp Booger: LOL! Just kidding. Probably not much would have changed. Mongolia was a communist nation until the early 1990s, not much change then being part of communist China. Probably not much in the way of industrialization either, since Mongolia has nothing to industrialize. It would probably be one of many undeveloped provincial backwaters of China similar to the Western Mohammedan provinces.


MG1962a: Probably all that would change is a lot more of the land would be under cultivation. And the mining boon would have started a lot sooner. A little piece of trivia. Mongolia up until a couple of years ago was the only place left in the world using dredging to mine gold.


Futurist: So, no significant changes in Mongolian demographics?


MG1962a: Who would notice. The place has a population density nearly half that of western Kansas. Once you get outside the capital, you have 2 million people spread across an area the size of Alaska.


deaf tuner: I have doubts. You could check Taiwan and Tibet changes in ethnic dynamics.


Futurist: Tibet is still over 90% ethnically Tibetan, though.


deaf tuner: I did say "changes". I was referring to evolution in time. So, just give it a bit more time.


YouLoveMeYouKnowIt: Much more developed than Outer Mongolia. The GDP per capita in Inner Mongolia is among the highest in China.


评论5: YouLoveMeYouKnowIt: The truth is not that you have to be either Chinese or Mongolian: Chinese is a supranational identity under which the Han, Manchu, and Mongol ethnic identities, among others, coexist. We should not toss out centuries of political traditions and look at the past seven decades as something more natural. Inner and Outer Mongolia were both regions of the Qing Empire. It just happens so one side become independent/puppet (to USSR) and the other remained part of the successor state of the Qing Empire (the People's Republic). Being on the Chinese side does not mean a diluting Mongol blood, culture, identity, arts, music, etc... Being on the independent side does not mean a new height for Mongol culture.


Futurist: That's an argument in favor of multi-ethnic states in general, no? For instance, keeping the Soviet unx, Austria-Hungary, and the Ottoman Empire intact, keeping British India united after independence, et cetera.


YouLoveMeYouKnowIt: No.I am just stating the reality of China. It is what it is. China is multiethnic. It just is. That reality on its own has no assertion on should have happened to British India, OE, USSR or Austria-Hungary and I make no assertion or argument either. Similarly, asserting the fact that Japan is an ethnostate is not arguing for keeping Nazi Germany.


Futurist: Makes sense. BTW, do you think that China should get Tawang and Kokang back? Also, how many people do you think that Mongolia can sustain? FTR, I'm only talking about Outer Mongolia here.


YouLoveMeYouKnowIt: I'd prefer to see a China with the territory of the Qing Empire at its height, along with a couple of Arctic, Antarctic, Lunar and Martial permanent settlements. Maybe Kokang and Tawang are included within these borders. But my want and opinion doesn't matter. I am not sure how many Mongolia could sustain, but as a landlocked, low income country and at the mercy of two Asian giants, it is very disadvantaged and may not be able to develop too much without direct rule or autonomous government taking orders from Beijing.


deaf tuner: Question : why "direct rule", "taking orders"?


deaf tuner: Why will it fare better as a province than as an independent state?


YouLoveMeYouKnowIt: I just stated. Because it will be Chinese and part of China, and thus ruled by and transcended by China instead of being left alone. Building projects, infrastructure projects. Inner Mongolia is way ahead of Mongolia.


Futurist: Well, Mongolia could receive a lot of Chinese subsidies if it would be a part of China proper.